Suffer the children #385

[The Moan Ranger]

Hmmm.

Yours is a case ( I won't say special). I train the Boy. I am his 6th Dad. You bring up children. We all do, What we are really on about here is those who d NOT bring up children. They let them run and go off like feral animals. What can Gordo do about that?

It's  a conundrum.

No it's not. Pay one parent, through the tax system, to stay at home. Remove the laws that say you may not smack your child. Allow teachers to smack children. Bring back the sort of discipline we knew. Make Life mean life. Don't sentence someone to 5 years and let them out after three. Give them thirty years and let them out after 25.
GET TOUGH ~ don't talk tough ~ be it.

Yes. In the main. Are we related?

[Snoopy]

I still contend it's about bringing up kids!

Not arguing that. Of course it is about bringing up kids ... but if there is no financial incentive to marry or stay married and no encouragement for one parent to stay at home to be there and know what their children are up to then we have no chance of changing anything. In fact if Mrs S and I were to divorce we would be better off because of the way the current tax system works. That is a nonsense.

[GROWLER]

It's little wonder, and comes as no suprise that Brits. are leaving this simmering crock of shite called the U.K. in record numbers now, only tobe replaced by more freeloading imigrants who know damned well they are in for a free for all bean feast courtesy of us hard working overburdened tax payers.

How much more can we all take, before this increasing violence, thuggery and general 2 fingers to society explodes into total anarchy and all out civil disobedience on our streets courtesy of those whose patience is fast running out with this toothless bloody government. They are so full of shit it beggars belief.

[GROWLER]

Prime Minister Gordon Brown described the killing as a "heinous crime that shocked the whole of the country", and extended his sympathy to Rhys family.

Speaking at Downing Street following a pre-planned summit on youth disorder and gangs, Mr Brown said: "The people responsible will be tracked down, arrested and punished."


More useless worthless meaningless shite from our 'great' leader.

Look you waste of space, we want positive action and swinging radical reforms in this country NOW, not more repetitive lip service.
I suppose he's going to say that "we shall learn from this tradgedy so it cannot happen again"
Yea, right on brother. pass me another spliff.

[Berek]

[: "The people responsible will be tracked down, arrested and punished."
[/i]

already quoted by Berek in the original post..

[Misunderstood]

Never mind suffer the children - Suffer the bloody nation.

I am sick and tired of people telling me that the country is going to the dogs and if we don't do something anarchy will rule.   It's all rubbish.    It has happened already.

Decent people these days go out to work in the morning, work all day Monday and most of Tuesday for the taxman and go home and barricade themselves in and watch the decrepit junk on the box or play here on the net, because if truth is told, we don't want to be outside risking our necks any more.  The streets belong to the mob.

The more we stay in the greater the freedom we are granting to the rabble that now run the streets.  We can't control them, the police can't control them, nobody can!  It's already history,  these thugs are all comfortably installed in council houses and paid-for lodgings and rearing their own kids and we are paying for them!  Children that are being brought up to fight as babies and weaned on knives in brutal drug-ridden crime pit environments.  Kids in this kind will be even more uncivilised, reaching a degree further towards their feral roots.  They are being born and raised right now!

In my childhood, the schoolteachers were ex-servicemen well used to discipline and so were the police, I grew up to respect them and call them sir.  It is only this kind of child rearing that keeps civilisation going.   These days even I don't have any respect for the bunch of tossers that can't do anything, so I can hardly expect semi-feral kid to give respect can I?    This IS the generation that EXPECTS do do what it wants in any way they want and we get to pay and like it. 

'If you come to school we'll give you an iPod' or 'If you break the law we'll send you on a holiday',  'You've been naughty so you'll really have to promise to be good or we'll give you a medal!'   For Fu?k's sake when are we going to get our pathetic heads out of our arses and do something?  Oh right - I forgot, we gave away the right to protest didn't we?  We just make silly jibes at people that care enough to stand up and defy the authorities. Bad luck!

It is far too late to be talking about changing a few laws, surely we know by now that anything we do is fatally flawed because we cannot hurt the children, we must preserve their rights to run amok and never - ever humiliate them because it's not civilised!  Relax, safe in the knowledge that in a generation these people will be the prime population of Britain, and they will share power with anarchists and nutcases from around the world that will find Britain to be the only country that will accept them - English not required!

The days of griping about it are fading - fast.  The price we all will have paid for electing amateurs to government and being too bloody stupid to learn from our mistakes.  We have stood by and watched all this coming and did nothing.  Stick your neck out now and it will get arrested or blown clean off.

Enjoy!

[Barman]

Never mind suffer the children - Suffer the bloody nation.

I am sick and tired of people telling me that the country is going to the dogs and if we don't do something anarchy will rule.   It's all rubbish.    It has happened already.

Decent people these days go out to work in the morning, work all day Monday and most of Tuesday for the taxman and go home and barricade themselves in and watch the decrepit junk on the box or play here on the net, because if truth is told, we don't want to be outside risking our necks any more.  The streets belong to the mob.

The more we stay in the greater the freedom we are granting to the rabble that now run the streets.  We can't control them, the police can't control them, nobody can!  It's already history,  these thugs are all comfortably installed in council houses and paid-for lodgings and rearing their own kids and we are paying for them!  Children that are being brought up to fight as babies and weaned on knives in brutal drug-ridden crime pit environments.  Kids in this kind will be even more uncivilised, reaching a degree further towards their feral roots.  They are being born and raised right now!

In my childhood, the schoolteachers were ex-servicemen well used to discipline and so were the police, I grew up to respect them and call them sir.  It is only this kind of child rearing that keeps civilisation going.   These days even I don't have any respect for the bunch of tossers that can't do anything, so I can hardly expect semi-feral kid to give respect can I?    This IS the generation that EXPECTS do do what it wants in any way they want and we get to pay and like it. 

'If you come to school we'll give you an iPod' or 'If you break the law we'll send you on a holiday',  'You've been naughty so you'll really have to promise to be good or we'll give you a medal!'   For Fu?k's sake when are we going to get our pathetic heads out of our arses and do something?  Oh right - I forgot, we gave away the right to protest didn't we?  We just make silly jibes at people that care enough to stand up and defy the authorities. Bad luck!

It is far too late to be talking about changing a few laws, surely we know by now that anything we do is fatally flawed because we cannot hurt the children, we must preserve their rights to run amok and never - ever humiliate them because it's not civilised!  Relax, safe in the knowledge that in a generation these people will be the prime population of Britain, and they will share power with anarchists and nutcases from around the world that will find Britain to be the only country that will accept them - English not required!

The days of griping about it are fading - fast.  The price we all will have paid for electing amateurs to government and being too bloody stupid to learn from our mistakes.  We have stood by and watched all this coming and did nothing.  Stick your neck out now and it will get arrested or blown clean off.

Enjoy!

Excellent post!
 

[Marley's Ghost (Imbiber of Spirits)]

Agreed Barman, agreed. I vote that the post of the week, I do.

[Berek]

Tell you what, it takes a lot to bring a tear to my eye but that press conference was heart rending, those poor parents..

Strange how I was never moved that way by the McCanns 

[Nick]

Something odd(er) there

[Snoopy]

I know it's long but this is worth reading from

A Hard Rain's Gonna Fall

As yet another shooting leaves an 11-year-old dead in Liverpool, former Durham firearms officer David Blackie explores why the Government needs to tackle Britain's spiralling gun crime.

WE are reaping the harvest of those prophetic words of the Bob Dylan song, 'I saw guns and sharp swords in the hands of young children'. It is a reality on our streets; this is not the sad tale of child soldiers in West Africa, it is our children who are the aggressors and the victims, dying for absolutely nothing at all.

On Wednesday evening, an 11-year-old child, Rhys Jones, was shot in Croxteth, Liverpool and died from his wounds - the victim of a ride-by shooting on a BMX bike. A youth of 18, barely an adult, and another child of 14 have been arrested in connection with a crime which is beyond any comprehension.
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Yet this kind of serious crime is becoming all too common. On the same day, a few hours later, in Elswick, Newcastle, another 17 year old was the victim of a stabbing involving a 16 and a 14 year old. On June 9, 15-year-old Alex Mulumbu was stabbed to death in Lambeth by a gang of youths. On September 9 last year, 15-year-old Jessie James was shot while riding his bicycle through a park in Moss Side in Manchester. His crime: defying peer pressure to join the gangland culture prevalent in the city.

We have urban child soldiers, wearing body armour, roaming our streets demanding 'respect' and settling petty disputes with knives or guns. More than five per cent of all firearms-related injuries treated by hospitals last year were suffered by under 16s - a frightening statistic and a bad omen for the future. Often, there is no obvious underlying cause, as in the case of Rhys, but it is merely a demonstration of misplaced juvenile machismo.

Tony Blair had a Cabinet summit on gun crime in February, the present Prime Minister held another yesterday to discuss the escalating problem of gangs and youth crime. Home Secretary Jacqui Smith said yesterday: "We are really serious about looking at what more we can do."

She talks of focus groups, of dialogue and engagement and wants to see greater use of Acceptable Behaviour Contracts - voluntary agreements under which offenders agree to mend their behaviour or face a more serious punishment. Tell this to the grieving family of Rhys Jones. The time for holding summits and talking about causes is over; we must start to deal with the consequences, and do so firmly.

Politicians talk glibly of the responsibility of schools and the break-down of the family as underlying causes, but do little to remove the constraints which have been placed upon the police and the courts to allow them a freedom to take decisive action against this scourge of violence.

Over the last 30 years, the primary functions of the police have been corrupted. No longer does it appear that the protection of life and property, the maintenance of order, the prevention and detection of crime and the prosecution of offenders against the peace are the key concerns of the police. These have been replaced by the role of community social worker, the bean counter of political targets and accountability, the arbiter of political correctness and the guardian of human rights.

It is a relief to see that the Chief Constable of Cleveland, Sean Price, is to put more policemen on the streets to weed out the 'bad men', although the 'zero tolerance' promoted by former 'Robocop', Ray Mallon is more what public opinion is vociferously demanding.

"Give the police more powers" is the knee-jerk reaction when there is any suggestion of a break down of law and order. They do not need any more powers, just the support and confidence to enforce them. There are too many hurdles to jump through before the offenders even reach the court system, such as the Crown Prosecution Service Charging Standards, and too many restrictions on sentencing for magistrates and judges from the Lord Chancellor and his Department of Justice and the Sentencing Guidelines Council and Panel. We should return to the police and the judiciary the power of discretion and reduce the over-burdening administration and bureaucracy.

Numerous theories of punishment have been advanced over the years, notably deterrence, rehabilitation and retribution. Successive governments have regarded various of these theories as being more influential than the others, but the failure to adopt a single principled approach to sentencing has now become a matter of real concern. The Criminal Justice Act 1991 favoured retribution, that criminals should get their 'just deserts'. The 2003 version is far more watered down, referring to the need, in addition to punishment, for a reduction in crime, reform and rehabilitation, the protection of the public and the making of reparation to those affected by crime. Even with the judgement of Solomon, it is difficult to see how a court can effectively apply each appropriately and consistently when sentencing.

Even when offenders have been given custodial sentences there are the inevitable whinges from government over prison overcrowding and expenditure. Perhaps the regimes of prison could bear some re-evaluation with their costly and over sensitive education systems, the privileges of televisions in cells and the over emphasis on prisoners' rights. What right can anyone have to take away the life of an 11-year-old boy and what rights does that perpetrator deserve?

There have been amnesties for guns and knives many times before but now, more than ever, society needs to rid them from our streets. Let us again see a national amnesty, but let the Government leave in no doubt those who seek to retain their weapons that they will suffer the maximum penalty which the law allows.

Give back to the police and the courts the assurance that they will have the support of government and the public to arrest and sentence effectively. Allow them to help us to reclaim our communities, street by street, estate by estate, town by town and city by city. Let us talk of consequences not of causes. Let it be known that society will no longer tolerate a gun culture, a gang culture or a yob culture.

If we fail in this now, while we still might have a chance, it will be a hard road back.

David Blackie was a member of the firearms team that attended the fatal shooting by Albert Dryden of Teesdale planning officer Harry Collinson at Butsfield, Consett, in 1991. He has since written a book about the case.

[Sour Puss]

And there is more,

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/merseyside/6963309.stm


Nightclub doormen shot in street
Two doormen have been shot outside a nightclub in Liverpool.

The men are being treated in hospital following the incident at the Alma de Santiago nightclub, which took place at 2230 BST on Friday.

Police have cordoned off the club, in Penny Lane, in the Mossley Hill area of the city.

A Merseyside Police spokesman said the men's condition is currently not known. The shootings come two days after Rhys Jones, 11, was shot dead in the city.

[Misunderstood]

It is telling that a mere wounding by gunshot doesn't even make the news front page any more...

The inevitable sign of the times?

Give us two years at this rate and there will just be the announcements in the Births and Deaths column.

[Snoopy]

In times like these who would you rather trust?


OR




'Nuff Said?

[Misunderstood]

'tis an old saying, but a very true one...

'If you live by the gun you must die by the gun'.

We can't stop them having guns so that means we should have then too, and be prepared to use them.