Ukraine: how is it going to end?

[Nick]

We have stayed off this topic but it is hard to ignore.

I am old enough to recall the Cuban missile crisis and recent events are nearly as worrying!

Between the fighting, the Russian position, Putin and the tidal wave of refugees I find it hard to see how this can be resolved and all it takes is one accidental incursion into Poland and we have serious trouble!!

So what do the intellects of the VP think?

[Steve]

Just too hard to work out with any certainty.  My best guess would be eventually Russia takes over and we have 20 years or more of cold war until Putin dies of old age.
 
Nobody should hold their breath waiting for a good ending any time soon. 

[Uncle Mort]

Too be completely honest I try not to think about it at all. But:

I see the Russians getting bogged down trying to subdue Ukraine, Sanctions bite and Russia falls apart. Unfortunately Putin won't go quietly. It could get quite nasty 

[Barman]

It would be impossible to overstate what a complete clusterfuck everything in my opinion... 

Years of climate change lunacy has left the West impotent and dependent on Russian energy - whatever you consider the cause of the conflict to be, the West can do little about it because of the risk of being cut off from its energy supplies...

...in the meanwhile we seem completely focussed on diversity and insisting that men with dicks are women... 

It can't end well at all and I have serious fears for the future world my grandchildren will grow up in.

How the fuck did we get here, I find it utterly depressing... 

[Nick]

ANyway, back on topic I reckon and anti Putin coup in Moscow might be the best outcome in the short term....

[Barman]

ANyway, back on topic I reckon and anti Putin coup in Moscow might be the best outcome in the short term....

They could put somebody worserer in power! 

[Nick]

 I did say short term....

[Barman]

I did say short term....

 

I've no idea who they might have up their sleeve... Presumably (hopefully) our diplomatic corps have their eye on the ball and know who would be in-line to the throne as it were... 

[Steve]

ANyway, back on topic I reckon and anti Putin coup in Moscow might be the best outcome in the short term....

Hard to see how that could actually occur.  It would have to be people close to Putin and then you have to look at whether they'd actually be better off as a result. 
 
IF and it's a very flakey 'if' there started to be real levels of mutiny in the armed forces then that could trigger such.  But we're not seeing it.

[apc2010]

We have stayed off this topic but it is hard to ignore.

I am old enough to recall the Cuban missile crisis and recent events are nearly as worrying!

Between the fighting, the Russian position, Putin and the tidal wave of refugees I find it hard to see how this can be resolved and all it takes is one accidental incursion into Poland and we have serious trouble!!

So what do the intellects of the VP think?

Intellects …….

[Uncle Mort]

Looks like it's getting closer to an end provided Ukraine agrees on dropping joining NATO ( already done as far as I can see) gives up on getting the Crimea back and parting with the Donbas region. It will probably be enough for now. No mention of reducing sanctions although Russia will expect trade etc. to go back to some sort of normal. Likely to happen but I would prefer that Russia be shunned by the rest of the world at least until Putin goes.

[Steve]

Looks like it's getting closer to an end provided Ukraine agrees on dropping joining NATO ( already done as far as I can see) gives up on getting the Crimea back and parting with the Donbas region. It will probably be enough for now. No mention of reducing sanctions although Russia will expect trade etc. to go back to some sort of normal. Likely to happen but I would prefer that Russia be shunned by the rest of the world at least until Putin goes.

That ending you predict will just encourage Putin to go for Moldova but it's hard to argue it won't happen
 
The sanctions should remain until Russian leaves, pays reparations, agrees to fair referendums in the disputed territories and surrenders Putin and generals various to the court in the Hague.  But I won't hold my breath waiting for such an outcome.

[Grumpmeister]

I hope to hell that this is just a case of someone in the Swedish intelligence service cocking up and getting things completely wrong but given that Sergei Shoigu (other than a dodgy looking zoom call) and Valeri Gerasimov have apparently dropped out of sight I have a bad feeling about all of this.

https://metro.co.uk/2022/03/30/russian-fighter-jets-flew-into-eu-airspace-while-armed-with-nukes-16376837/

[Steve]

I hope to hell that this is just a case of someone in the Swedish intelligence service cocking up and getting things completely wrong but given that Sergei Shoigu (other than a dodgy looking zoom call) and Valeri Gerasimov have apparently dropped out of sight I have a bad feeling about all of this.

https://metro.co.uk/2022/03/30/russian-fighter-jets-flew-into-eu-airspace-while-armed-with-nukes-16376837/

The incursion was real, the UK tabloids have added in the nuclear angle.  It's what they do

[Steve]

So a question to those in Smugland
 
Here in Blighty we can still access Putin's https://www.rt.com/ including its live feed https://www.rt.com/on-air/
 
Can you?  On another forum someone is telling me both are blocked in the EU

And if so is this right?  IMHO blocking the live feed is, the web site not